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+--- Thread: Which Maps to Retire? (/showthread.php?tid=1637)
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - Wildt4lon - 02-07-2013 06:04 AM
Ok, so here's my view of what OneManLeft could do:
-Get rid of Reaper and Glitch. (My opinion only- you don't have to)
-Hold a competition on the mapmaker by Harti, and pick the best-rated maps as new maps/ choose their favourites on the mapmaker
-Moderate some of the existing maps to stop Foundry FTA, SFI Adorables top hex weakness, Peekaboo Scallywags turtleing favour (or just turtleing in general on that map), Reaper rush, and the Bombshell splash on the wit space in Thorn Gulley (from the protrusions in the holes)
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - GreatGonzales - 02-07-2013 07:05 AM
(02-07-2013 01:31 AM)burnodrod Wrote: I believe that all maps can be fixed.
On SI we need to remove the top hex to fix "the sniper hole" bug.
On Reaper this could be the fix for "the Mobi rush" problem (not shure though, need to test).
And this is the fix that I suggest for SP.
People who hate Sweetie Plains probably can't find the reason why they always lose the games on that map. There is a witspace on this map that you think it's yours. But it's not! Seriously, SP is the only map that has a witspace on equal distance from your spawn and your opponent's spawn. Check all other 1v1 and 2v2 maps out! Furthermore, you have an obstacle on your way to that witspace, while your opponent has a wide straight way which makes it easier for him to attack than for you to defend.
All STs know about that feature resulting in boring stupid fights for that one witspace. I suggest to move this witspace one hex closer to the base and remove one obstacle. Additionaly, it could be useful to get rid of some obstacles in the center of the map to ginger up fighting in that area.
+1 these changes. Though, why remove the back door entirely from reaper? That's kind of the "point" of that map.
But it sounds like this is the sort of thing that OML is proposing, they use the term "remixed" maps.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - aaronINdayton - 02-07-2013 07:58 AM
(02-07-2013 03:42 AM)Necrocat219 Wrote: Also Aaron I know you were being sarcastic but I would love the idea of randomly generated maps to stir things up as long as they were symmetrical
I actually really like this idea also, haha.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - The RawkHawk - 02-07-2013 08:42 AM
(02-07-2013 07:05 AM)GreatGonzales Wrote:(02-07-2013 01:31 AM)burnodrod Wrote: I believe that all maps can be fixed.
On SI we need to remove the top hex to fix "the sniper hole" bug.
On Reaper this could be the fix for "the Mobi rush" problem (not shure though, need to test).
And this is the fix that I suggest for SP.
People who hate Sweetie Plains probably can't find the reason why they always lose the games on that map. There is a witspace on this map that you think it's yours. But it's not! Seriously, SP is the only map that has a witspace on equal distance from your spawn and your opponent's spawn. Check all other 1v1 and 2v2 maps out! Furthermore, you have an obstacle on your way to that witspace, while your opponent has a wide straight way which makes it easier for him to attack than for you to defend.
All STs know about that feature resulting in boring stupid fights for that one witspace. I suggest to move this witspace one hex closer to the base and remove one obstacle. Additionaly, it could be useful to get rid of some obstacles in the center of the map to ginger up fighting in that area.
+1 these changes. Though, why remove the back door entirely from reaper? That's kind of the "point" of that map.
But it sounds like this is the sort of thing that OML is proposing, they use the term "remixed" maps.
I also believe all maps can and *should* be fixed rather than being removed. However - I also don't want to see changes that completely invalidate previously possible lines of attack (See the proposed Reaper change in this post for an example of what I mean). Mobi rush on reaper is dumb and should be fixed - but that doesnt mean a player should not be able to attack up the weaker side at all. Also - remember that the less lines of attack, the more it benefits turtling. And I don't like turtling.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - connor34911 - 02-07-2013 09:00 AM
(02-07-2013 08:42 AM)The RawkHawk Wrote:(02-07-2013 07:05 AM)GreatGonzales Wrote:(02-07-2013 01:31 AM)burnodrod Wrote: I believe that all maps can be fixed.
On SI we need to remove the top hex to fix "the sniper hole" bug.
On Reaper this could be the fix for "the Mobi rush" problem (not shure though, need to test).
And this is the fix that I suggest for SP.
People who hate Sweetie Plains probably can't find the reason why they always lose the games on that map. There is a witspace on this map that you think it's yours. But it's not! Seriously, SP is the only map that has a witspace on equal distance from your spawn and your opponent's spawn. Check all other 1v1 and 2v2 maps out! Furthermore, you have an obstacle on your way to that witspace, while your opponent has a wide straight way which makes it easier for him to attack than for you to defend.
All STs know about that feature resulting in boring stupid fights for that one witspace. I suggest to move this witspace one hex closer to the base and remove one obstacle. Additionaly, it could be useful to get rid of some obstacles in the center of the map to ginger up fighting in that area.
+1 these changes. Though, why remove the back door entirely from reaper? That's kind of the "point" of that map.
But it sounds like this is the sort of thing that OML is proposing, they use the term "remixed" maps.
I also believe all maps can and *should* be fixed rather than being removed. However - I also don't want to see changes that completely invalidate previously possible lines of attack (See the proposed Reaper change in this post for an example of what I mean). Mobi rush on reaper is dumb and should be fixed - but that doesnt mean a player should not be able to attack up the weaker side at all. Also - remember that the less lines of attack, the more it benefits turtling. And I don't like turtling.
Kind of random, but is the reaper rush still a problem? I don't use the rush anymore because I figure/have found that people generally know how to defend against it. Additionally, I pretty much always successfully defend the rush when I am P2 against adorables.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - Necrocat219 - 02-07-2013 10:00 AM
Quote:And this is the fix that I suggest for SP.
People who hate Sweetie Plains probably can't find the reason why they always lose the games on that map. There is a witspace on this map that you think it's yours. But it's not! Seriously, SP is the only map that has a witspace on equal distance from your spawn and your opponent's spawn. Check all other 1v1 and 2v2 maps out! Furthermore, you have an obstacle on your way to that witspace, while your opponent has a wide straight way which makes it easier for him to attack than for you to defend.
All STs know about that feature resulting in boring stupid fights for that one witspace. I suggest to move this witspace one hex closer to the base and remove one obstacle. Additionaly, it could be useful to get rid of some obstacles in the center of the map to ginger up fighting in that area.
+1 +1 +1! That would make me actually want to play sweetie plains! It's a complete nightmare of a map with terrible FTA in terms of spawning units. Also there is no leeway for varied play at all. That sniper has to survive no matter what, it's the only thing giving you advantage and the sides are much more attractive to attack than through the middle.
Quote:Kind of random, but is the reaper rush still a problem? I don't use the rush anymore because I figure/have found that people generally know how to defend against it. Additionally, I pretty much always successfully defend the rush when I am P2 against adorables.
What you described is actually the underlying problem of the reaper rush, the rock paper scizzors element of it. I'm assuming that everyone you play against moves their wit space runner twice to defend? If so you have a major FTA advantage that other races do not have as P1, starting your opponent off with 4 wits instead of 5.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - Derr furlong - 02-07-2013 10:22 AM
I feel like, if anything, that peekaboo is too close quarters, foundry is too open, and in the clever league long nine is a runner party, but I'd rather just having more maps or modifying existing ones that allow for less diverse play
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - .Memories. - 02-07-2013 10:25 AM
I've been playing Foundry more and more, and its gone from my least favorite / worst map to one of my favorites. I like how open it is; a welcomed change from most other maps.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - harvarnold - 02-07-2013 10:29 AM
(02-07-2013 10:00 AM)Necrocat219 Wrote:Actually, I think Sweetie Plains is Second Turn advantage because they have an easier time using both of their spawns because of the extra wits. Send me a friendly and we can test it out.Quote:And this is the fix that I suggest for SP.
People who hate Sweetie Plains probably can't find the reason why they always lose the games on that map. There is a witspace on this map that you think it's yours. But it's not! Seriously, SP is the only map that has a witspace on equal distance from your spawn and your opponent's spawn. Check all other 1v1 and 2v2 maps out! Furthermore, you have an obstacle on your way to that witspace, while your opponent has a wide straight way which makes it easier for him to attack than for you to defend.
All STs know about that feature resulting in boring stupid fights for that one witspace. I suggest to move this witspace one hex closer to the base and remove one obstacle. Additionaly, it could be useful to get rid of some obstacles in the center of the map to ginger up fighting in that area.
+1 +1 +1! That would make me actually want to play sweetie plains! It's a complete nightmare of a map with terrible FTA in terms of spawning units. Also there is no leeway for varied play at all. That sniper has to survive no matter what, it's the only thing giving you advantage and the sides are much more attractive to attack than through the middle.
RE: Which Maps to Retire? - Silverlapras1747 - 02-07-2013 02:39 PM
Don't get rid of foundry it's my favorite map next to long nine!!!!